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bartleby
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confused high quality pictures at night - outside

hello again,

atm i am trying to see how our project looks like at night (version 5.2).

now... inside 0-4 aa looks quite good an with path activated slightly better.

but when i try to make a picture i have problems if i want more pixel (tried 3000) or best quality - picture is getting really really dark, nearly black. with lower pixel (200-1000) and/or just "better" qualitysettings everything looks as expected.
i would like to render one outsideview with perhaps 3400 pixel to be able to print it a least on DIN A3.

sadly can't upload pictures to the forum and dont want to us something like dropbox. in our company we got last year a nice virus from there ;).
atm. a renderingtest last with 12 cores 3+ hours - so i just canceled many tests after 2 hours (would be great i you could save the current picture if you stop the rendering).

second problem is that i have no clue what the other settings do:
- where are those filters explained (adv. rendering)?
- what do all the other settings really do?
- which settings are recommended?

greetings
bart
[Feb 23, 2016 7:22:09 AM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Ceciliabr
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Re: high quality pictures at night - outside

Hello Bart,

I really need to see your project to be able to comment on this, so instead I will try to say something about my own procedures for rendering exteriors after dark.

There are no lights provided in SH3D when the sun has set, so I have to add my own lights : perhaps moonlight, some streetlights, the faint city lights illuminating the horizon, and of course the lights illuminating my object and it's surroundings.

First of all I make a new level, some fifteen-twenty meter above the top of my construction, where I spread out a dozen or more halogen lights. This will be the general light for the scene, and I will adjust the intensity until if gives the desired result.

Then i make another layer, or level, this time some three to five meters above ground, where I can place lights to illuminate the wall of the house, and the surroundings where needed.

For daytime a blue sky, or a textured sky, will produce a nice result, but after dark the sky will go completely black, unless it's textured. Neither a completely black sky nor a daytime sky, will normally give the right impression, so you need to apply a night-texture to the sky. I'm normally using gradient textures that I make with Photoshop. A light orange at the horizon, with a quick fade to a very dark blue. You can add a faint overlay of real clouds to make a more interesting sky, you have to experiment – and keep in mind that only a fraction of the lowest part your texture will actually be visible – and also that the rendered sky will look a bit different than it does in the preview-window. The gradient at the bottom should be very small. I normally make my sky-textures in 2560 px x 1440 px, which is the size of my display.
I normally render low quality previews a lot during the process. Setting light for a night scene can be quite a challenge.

This, of course, requires a powerful computer, preferably a twelve core processor like the one you are using, and a lot of ram. I have edited the memory configuration ( the info.plist) to 16348m, and I have no problems rendering 4K pictures.
A complicated 4K rendering can take many hours, so I usually start them right before bedtime, and normally they are done the next morning. I have never actually timed a 4K rendering, but a A 2K rendering takes 2-3 hours, depending on the complexity.
Sh3D ( or Sunflower), does not use the graphic-cards for rendering. That's probably why it's so slow, but on the other hand, that leaves the graphic cards free for simultaneous rendering in other programs.

I hope this makes any sense…
If I find the time I will post some pictures to visualize the process.
[Feb 23, 2016 4:10:51 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message    http://cecprojects.wordpress.com [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
bartleby
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Re: high quality pictures at night - outside

hm.... moonlight and streetlights are nice ideas. hope i wont need them too much, feels a bit like cheating :). but maybe a function to add a bit backgroundlight would make things easier (like with the ceiling light - even though i dont need it anymore, enough light *g*).

today rendering worked quite like it should, think main problem was the "path". it was frustrating that my smaller previewpictures with same qualitysettings were much brighter.

today i testet "causticsPhotons" with 1.000.000. gave some white artefacts. i have no clue what this setting really makes. maybe because of my bad english.

also nowhere the filters are explained.

what does "normalLens.focusDistance" or "normalLens.radius"?
is it usefull to change those?

i will see if i can upload some pictures.

between - why is it good to set AA indoor to "0-4"? why not... well.. 4-4 or 5-5?
why should AA be lower at night (saw that tip in the forum).
[Feb 23, 2016 8:06:52 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
bartleby
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Re: high quality pictures at night - outside

most pictures still on old pc and i cancel most tries to change things :).
but see yourself: https://goo.gl/photos/8TydRgfpNTQLHDkP6.
project just 146mb atm.
[Feb 23, 2016 8:44:08 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
bartleby
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Re: high quality pictures at night - outside

hm... can't edit my own post.

well. inside AA 0-4 is great, path too. outside everything default works much better. more pixel = better quality = very much more time to render seems to be the way.

today i got a really nice picture (about 3400x1913 pixel) in 7,5 hours after deleting everything not visible with standard settings :). Ok AA i had 1-3, but i think that was useless, 1-2 would have been fine.
same picture at daytime takes just minutes...

is there a button to switch every light on the map off - so i dont have to edit every single lightsource? weren't lights automatically switched off at daytime with version 5.1?
[Feb 25, 2016 1:30:29 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Ceciliabr
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Re: high quality pictures at night - outside

No, you can't edit your own post.

You should organize your light sources in different groups. That makes it easy to switch them on and off.

I will try to post a few examples on night/day when my surroundings get a little less demanding :)
[Feb 25, 2016 2:12:25 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message    http://cecprojects.wordpress.com [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
okh
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Re: high quality pictures at night - outside

..light sources in different groups...
Yes and you can modify multiple instances of the same model, typically to adjust the light power. However, as I find these groups of light sources often get in the way when drawing, it could also be a nice trick to place the light sources on a separate level (Plan-Add Level at same elevation). This - for me - is especially true when you have lots of downlights in the ceiling. ok
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Ceciliabr
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Re: high quality pictures at night - outside

BTW, regarding depth of field, I think it's when the camera is behaving like a real camera where you have to focus on the object. But I haven't figured out what the numbers mean. The distance value might be centimeters, or they may refer to some internal scale. The normal lens radius might refer to the "circle of confusion", but again; just guessing.
Maybe there's a manual somewhere.
[Feb 25, 2016 2:32:09 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message    http://cecprojects.wordpress.com [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Ceciliabr
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Re: high quality pictures at night - outside

I have made a couple of renderings to illustrate the Depth of Field - options.
The distance is obviously centimeters, measured (I think) from the center of the circle ( on your camera-avatar), to the object ( or the part of the object) you want to be in focus. To find the exact distance, you can use the "Create dimensions"-tool – which is actually a tape measure.

Two renderings:

Distance: 130
Lens = 2

http://ceciliabr.com/sh3d/DOF-test-dist=130-lens=2.png


Distance = 130
Lens = 5

http://ceciliabr.com/sh3d/DOF-test-dist=130-lens=5.png



So, obviously a higher lens value gives a shallower depth of field.

Of course you will have to select "Depth of Field" from the Lens roll-down-menu for the settings to have any effect.

... and about "cheating" with lighting-effects, I will start a new thread: It might be of general interest...
[Feb 25, 2016 6:44:44 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message    http://cecprojects.wordpress.com [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Ceciliabr
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Re: high quality pictures at night - outside

@okh

You are right. Using separate levels is a time-saver and a cure for o lot of frustrations.
I'm using levels a lot, almost like layers in Photoshop, and with the option to control visibility, it works perfectly.
One thing should be said about levels, though, that when you copy with cmd-left-click, it is copied to the level you are working on, like if you are using cmd-c & cmd-v.
And if the object is huge - like f.i. a terrain – ctrl-x hangs the machine for several minutes.

Why would I use ctrl-x?
To move it to the right level, because I have tweaked the copied element so much (on the wrong level), that don't want to lose my work.

Just mentioning it...
[Feb 25, 2016 7:02:15 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message    http://cecprojects.wordpress.com [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
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