Print at Aug 17, 2019 6:11:30 PM
Posted by Ceciliabr at Jul 15, 2016 10:11:49 PM
Hither and yon?
I have run into a small problem making videos with the "same rendering as in the 3D view"-setting. What I see in the preview window does not match the video output.

This is my terrain as viewed in the preview window( screenshot):



And this it is how it appears when making a video or creating a photo using the "same rendering as in the 3D view"-setting.





Rendering with photo-quality though, always gives the same result as viewed in the preview-window.

Is this maybe an OpenGL-issue, and is there any way to get around this?

cec

Posted by okh at Jul 16, 2016 9:27:28 AM
Re: Hither and yon?
This looks similar to something I have seen before, where the photo rendering shows a different perspective for distant objects. Then there were a couple of pictures with a tree-line outside a window. I am sure I have seen it somewhere, but cannot find it. Anyone remember? ok

Posted by Ceciliabr at Jul 16, 2016 12:46:40 PM
Re: Hither and yon?
okh;


The reason I'm wondering if this is a hither-and-yon-problem, is that although none of the boxes are overlapping, they appear to be overlapped in the preview-window.

Rendering with "same as preview"-setting, none of the boxes are visible, while rendering with HQ, everything appears perfectly normal.



cec

Posted by Ceciliabr at Jul 16, 2016 12:52:59 PM
Re: Hither and yon?
In case anyone is interested:
here is the SH3D-file

http://ceciliabr.com/sh3d/HITHER-YON.sh3d

Posted by Puybaret at Jul 16, 2016 12:53:28 PM
Re: Hither and yon?
Maybe, it could be a bug that happens on how the frustrum is used in offscreen and onscreen modes. How far are the far away objects from the camera? Could you send me a simple case showing the problem?
----------------------------------------
Emmanuel Puybaret, Sweet Home 3D developer

Posted by Ceciliabr at Jul 16, 2016 2:23:11 PM
Re: Hither and yon?
@Puybaret

The link is in my last post

Project file

Posted by Puybaret at Jul 17, 2016 11:49:24 AM
Re: Hither and yon?
Our messages were posted at the same time wink
I could reproduce your issue on my computer, and will give you some news soon.
----------------------------------------
Emmanuel Puybaret, Sweet Home 3D developer

Posted by Puybaret at Jul 19, 2016 2:36:48 PM
Re: Hither and yon?
I made some tests and this is definitively bound to the upper distance of the frustrum beyond which objects are not displayed in 3D. The astonishing thing is that this distance is the same in onscreen (3D view) and offscreen (i.e. Q1 and Q2 photos) modes, but your objects are very close to the limit set in Sweet Home 3D. If you move away the observer a few hundred meters more away from the scene, they will disappear too.
I could increase this upper distance to make far objects viewable, but then there would be some risks that objects in the nearby of the camera wouldn't look correct confused
----------------------------------------
Emmanuel Puybaret, Sweet Home 3D developer

Posted by Ceciliabr at Jul 20, 2016 5:35:21 PM
Re: Hither and yon?
Thanks for your answer. I suspected that was the case, but it's nice to get it confirmed. :)
(Illustration just in case someone who reads this post is wondering about hither / yon and frustum):



I was wondering; would it be possible to implement the hither/yon-adjustments in a future version, or maybe as a plugin?

The obvious work-around is of course to make far-away objects smaller and place them closer to the camera,
or accept a slightly lower quality and use screen-recording to capture the video directly from the preview-window.

cec

Posted by Puybaret at Sep 6, 2017 6:00:28 PM
Re: Hither and yon?
The front and back distances (hither / yon) are computed differently in version 5.5, in the hope this should solve your issue. Objects placed very far should been seen in much more cases now as long as you don't place also objects behind the point of view.
----------------------------------------
Emmanuel Puybaret, Sweet Home 3D developer

Posted by Ceciliabr at Sep 16, 2017 6:36:58 PM
Re: Hither and yon?
Well...
It seems that what you have done is to adjust the preview, so that it resembles what you get when creating pictures in Q1 and Q2.
The problem now is that it's very difficult to compose sceneries for Q3 and Q4 images.

Examples:

V5.3


V5.5b


As you can see from the second screenshot, we can no longer preview the placement and size of distant objects, such a horizon or a distant city, or other elements that will be quite visible in Q3 and Q4.

I have included the project file, just in case...

SH3D-project



cec

Posted by Puybaret at Sep 22, 2017 4:59:43 PM
Re: Hither and yon?
There's no frustrum in rendering quality 3 and 4, that's why the rendered image is black as soon as the camera is placed in a wall. But at the opposite, the image because very noisy if the elevation of the camera is very high, and that's the reason why I limited it to 100 m.

With OpenGL (i.e. in the 3D view and at quality 1 and 2), the changes I programmed should give more predictable and usable results: when the camera is within the (approximated) bounding box which contains all the items of the scene, the front clip distance (hither) is 2,5 cm and the back clip distance (yon) is 3000 x 2,5 = 75 m (3000 is a recommended ratio between those distances).
When the camera is out of that bounding box (which is not the last case you submitted), the front distance is equal to the distance between the camera and the closest face of that box, or if it's smaller, the distance between the camera and the floor at the intersection of the floor and the bottom of the viewing frustrum. The back clip distance is normally 3000 farther, except if there's some chances that the horizon is cut too close of the camera. I could make a drawing if necessary to explain this rule.
How to apply this new rule in your case: don't create a scenery object that will surround the camera completely, so you're sure that you can place the camera out of that scenery box. The farther the camera will be of that box, the larger the front and back clip distances will be. For example, if you want the back clip distance to be equal to 450 m, you should be at 450 / 3000 = 0,15 m = 15 cm of the box. This is not so far! smile

Hope you can achieve what you want to do with these new rules and without the obligation to add in a future version some new fields to enter the front and/or back clip distances. I really feel that this kind of information isn't for the public primarily targeted by Sweet Home 3D.
----------------------------------------
Emmanuel Puybaret, Sweet Home 3D developer

Posted by Ceciliabr at Jun 21, 2018 10:55:45 AM
Re: Hither and yon?
@Puybaret

I have a feeling I should never have brought this up, since the adjustments you made went totally in the wrong direction (for me).

Anyway, up until recently I have been able to use 5.3 for constructing and rendering bigger sceneries.
But if I want to take advantage of the new features introduced in later versions ( texture handling, rotation, lighting etc.), I can not use V5.3.

A preview in v5.3 can look like this:


In v5.7, however, a preview will look like this:



which makes it somewhat challenging to compose a nice picture, having to more or less guess what my composition will look like.

Of course I can still use 5.3 it to compose my pictures, and then copy the coordinates of the virtual visitor manually from 5.3 to 5.7,
and render it with the correct texturing:



But it's a time consuming process going back and forth, opening heavy project files.

As you are pointing out: this has no interest for "the public primarily targeted by Sweet Home 3D".
Exactly; so I'm just wondering:
Do you think the public primarily targeted by Sweet Home 3D would notice any difference if you were to change the frustrum back to what it was in v 5.3?


Cec

Posted by Puybaret at Sep 5, 2018 9:41:03 PM
Re: Hither and yon?
The frustrum issue should be fixed in the coming Sweet Home 3D 6.0.

Actually, I discovered that most graphics cards (maybe even all?) support a Z-buffer of 24 bit, therefore I forced the Z-buffer bits to 24 instead of the default value of 16, and this nicely resolved the issue.
It will even optimize a little the rendering speed when the point of view changes, because less computing is required with a larger Z-buffer! smile
----------------------------------------
Emmanuel Puybaret, Sweet Home 3D developer